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wrong dates?

 
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Hatshepsut76
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Joined: 10 Apr 2005
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Location: Roma, Italy

PostPosted: Sun Aug 21, 2005 12:01 pm    Post subject: wrong dates? Reply with quote

Hi people! Wink
Yesterday I was looking at a book of an Italian Egypt's historian, whose name is Sergio Donadoni; inside it there is a chronological scheme of Egyptian Dynasties... Looking at it, I was surprised when I saw that in the MK the period of reign from Dyn 13th to Dyn. 17th comprehends 150 years, from 1750 to 1600 BCE; in the Second Intermediate Period, the 17 th Dyn. reigns from 1715 to 1540... So there is a period in which two Dynasties reign in the same period: how can it be possible?
Thanks a lot!!!
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 21, 2005 12:01 pm    Post subject: Advertisement

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Ramsekh
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Joined: 03 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 21, 2005 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm. In this book I have by Aidan Dodson it shows the Middle Kingdom is from the middle of the 11th dynasty through the 15th (no 14th dynasty?). A total of 416 years. 2066-1650.

I dunno if I'm talking about the same thing or not. Am I? Laughing
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Lostris
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Joined: 05 May 2005
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Location: Miskolc, Hungary

PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2005 7:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I got three different versions for the question in three different books. One is as the same as Ramsekh's. The another is in that Oxford History of Ancient Egypt - it writes that the middle kingdom was started from the 11th dynasty (with Mentuhotep II in 2055 B.C.) to the 14th dynasty (ended in 1650 B.C.) That's 405 years total... and the S.I. period is from 1650 to 1550 (sure it's not exactly, but let's say...) so it's 100 years. The another is in Kent R. Weeks' book (it's about the Kv5) the M.K. is from 2040 to 1782 - 258 years. So every book writes another date... who knows exactly?
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tnrees
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Joined: 09 Jul 2005
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Location: Taunton, UK

PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2005 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you are interested in dates (including overlaping dynasties0 see www.centuries.co.uk
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Hatshepsut76
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks a lot for the link!!! Wink
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Neb-Ma'at-Re
Pharaoh


Joined: 09 Dec 2003
Posts: 690

PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 9:18 pm    Post subject: Re: wrong dates? Reply with quote

Hatshepsut76 wrote:
Hi people! Wink
Yesterday I was looking at a book of an Italian Egypt's historian, whose name is Sergio Donadoni; inside it there is a chronological scheme of Egyptian Dynasties... Looking at it, I was surprised when I saw that in the MK the period of reign from Dyn 13th to Dyn. 17th comprehends 150 years, from 1750 to 1600 BCE; in the Second Intermediate Period, the 17 th Dyn. reigns from 1715 to 1540... So there is a period in which two Dynasties reign in the same period: how can it be possible?
Thanks a lot!!!


Hi Hatshesut76. I think I may be able to explain the answer to your question.

First, we know that the Intermediate Periods of Ancient Egypt were eras where foreign rulers took over Egypt and/or the Two Lands were divided and ceased to be unified by one king. During these times, particularly the beginings of the First and Second Intermediate Periods, there were many short lived reigns by fairly insignificant rulers. Record keeping gets a bit obscure during these periods, which explains the various dates and chronologies amongst historians and Egytpologist. We do have some texts that provide some clarity like the Turin Canon to name one(in your home land!) but there is still some info missing. A number of other ancient sources conflict with the Turin Canon as well as with each other.

Secondly, during the Second Intermediate period foreigners such as the Hyksos (Dyn. 15-17) ruled from the Delta region. During the 17th dynasty, a line of Theban princes began gaining power and ruled concurrently in the south with the Hykos in the North until Kamose expelled them and once again unified the Two Lands. This explains the overlap of the two dynasties: The 17th Dynasty Hyksos in the North and the 17th Dynasty Theban Princes in the South who both claimed rule over Egypt during this time.This type 'split rule' may have occured throughout the whole of the Second intermediate period.

Sergio Donadoni and other historians/Egyptologists may consider the reigns of the Egyptian rulers during this time frame to be part of the Middle Kingdom and the reign of the foreign rulers (Asiatics and Hyksos) to be the Second Intermediate Period.

Hope this helps.
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Last edited by Neb-Ma'at-Re on Tue Nov 15, 2005 9:37 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Hatshepsut76
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2005 9:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Surely, Neb-Ma'at Re, it helps a lot!
Thanks for your explanation!!!
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tnrees
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Joined: 09 Jul 2005
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2005 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just been to a talk - the lecturer said there might have been 5 different pharohs at the same time during the time of the Hyksos.
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Neb-Ma'at-Re
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2005 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting! Who gave the lecture?
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tnrees
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2005 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The lecture was by Charlotte Booth. She has just written a book on the Hyksosbut had sold out by the time I arrived at the meeting.
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Hatshepsut76
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2005 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The news concerning the five different Pharaos was interesting; I didn't remember it! Wink
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