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Hypothesis help (akhenaten)
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Gerbil
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Joined: 03 Apr 2005
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Location: Australia

PostPosted: Sun Apr 03, 2005 11:30 pm    Post subject: Hypothesis help (akhenaten) Reply with quote

I am a highschool student who is struggling to create a hypothesis if akhenaten conrtributed to the overall prosperity and wellbeing of Egypt? and to what extent did he live up to the sterotypical pharaoh as the all powerful god-king. i know for a fact what the next pharaoh did to his hieroglyphics ie. destroying the face erasing him from the history of Egypt, but I am trying to focus on the impact he had on the populace and if he helped the community, can anyone help me build on that Shocked if you could Very Happy
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Si-amun
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2005 6:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If one of your hypotheses is that Akhenaten contributed to the wealth and maintanance of Egypts greatness then you will be hard pushed to find a good argument for this, one in which the line of argument wont be obliterrated by counter-evidence.

And also, a minor point. It was not the successor of Akhenaten who removed his name from monuments, it happened a good few decades later under Pharaohs who were not related directly to Akhenaten.
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Gerbil
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2005 1:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

my bad... however it was my understanding that after the line of akhenaten was the start of the warrior pharaohs devoted to the retribution of Egpyt or am i still thinking of decades later. Also The task outline requires me to speak about the impact he had on the egyptian society if i dont have a great enough argument to speak about the impact he had on the society at that time, would it be better for me to speak about monotheism in his time Question thankyou for the help though Very Happy also i would like to ask a question, to you particularly si-amun. I agree that ahkenaten neglected his obligation as a pharaoh and ignored trade with the hittites, but it was my understanding that there are documents going back and forth about how he was ignoring trade, but I heard that there are documents coming from Egypt saying that he WAS trying to do something about it? can someone help me clarify.
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Gerbil
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No one loves me Sad
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NefertariAnubis
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 9:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We love you!! Very Happy
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Si-amun
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2005 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry, I didn't answer yesterday, it was my birthday!!! YAY!

Well, Akenaten wasd escended from several great kings, his father (Amenhotep III) was one of the greatest Kings in Egyptian History. he built many of the huge temples we recognise today, including the Temple of Luxor, extending Denderah as well as constructing a huge funeral complex and palace city on the West Bank of Waset. Latter there were warrior Pharaohs, but that was at least four Kings after Akhneaten, decades later when the 19th dynasty rose to prominence and Akhenatens family is thought to have completely died out.
If I am honest, I ahve not heard of any evidence from the time to say that Akhenaten was trying to increase trade, wealth etc. Then again, this doesn't mean that there was no evidence. It merely means that I dont know about it, perhaps someone else on the board will know some more?
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Gerbil
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 5:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thankyou for the help you guys have been great and i feel loved Very Happy Happy birthday amun Very Happy thanks again for the help.



BATMAN AWAY!!!!!!!!
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Osiris II
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Happy Birthday, Si-amun. Yours is the 5th? Mine's the 6th! Are you a typical Aries? (head-stong, impulsive, willful)
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Si-amun
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2005 10:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh my goodness. I couldn't be any more Aries if I tried! I am so like my star sign it is frightening! I have yet to find one attribute of an Aries that I dont fulfill! lol I am quite....

- Willful
- Stubborn
- Dominating
- Fiery
- Hot Tempered
- Cruel
- A Leader
- Creative
- Active
- Romantic
- Spendthrift

Oh dear, I have probably just painted a really awful picture of myself! Oh well! How Aries are you? And btw, happy birthday for yesterday (Aries is the star sign!)

On a side, my favourite colour is red (the colour of Aries), and I am most interested in the Egyptian God Amun Ra - quite often shown as a Ram (the sign of an Aries), being born in the year of the Dragon I am also supposed to be associated with the colour red! hehe!
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Kiya
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2005 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Originally posted by gerbil
Quote:
I am a highschool student who is struggling to create a hypothesis if akhenaten conrtributed to the overall prosperity and wellbeing of Egypt? and to what extent did he live up to the sterotypical pharaoh as the all powerful god-king. i know for a fact what the next pharaoh did to his hieroglyphics ie. destroying the face erasing him from the history of Egypt, but I am trying to focus on the impact he had on the populace and if he helped the community, can anyone help me build on that if you could


He still lived up to the idea of a powerful Egyptian King though. No one in Egypt could worship the god Aten except through Akhenaton, he was the High Priest. The next most senior guy in the priest hood was known as 'High Priest of akhenaton' I read somewhere.
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Osiris II
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2005 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This really isn't on topic, Si-amun. DM will swoop in and get us!
But I'm really not Aries (much). My rising sign is Capricorn, and I'm much more studious and sedate than most Aries--although stubborness rears it's head every once and awhile!
My favorite color? Blue, I would think.
Ram headed Ra appeals to me, too!
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People are mis-guided in referring to Akhenaton's monothesism. There were still various gods worshipped at Aketaten. And it's quite true--no one, except Akhenaten, was allowed to worship the Aton without praying first to Akhenaten to "speak" to Aton for him. The closing of the other temples and the eriadication of the name of Amun seems to have been more of a political ploy than a religious war. It was only the priesthood of Amun that was so severely perscuted. In fact, Akhenaten had an image of the Apis bull--or was it the bull itself?--brought to his city.
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Dark_Meryetamun_28
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2005 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Right you are, Osiris II. Topicy goodness, people.
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Osiris II
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2005 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought I could sneak it by--the second part IS on topic, DM. Thought you might misss the first part....silly me Embarassed
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Neb-Ma'at-Re
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2005 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Osiris II wrote:

People are mis-guided in referring to Akhenaton's monothesism. There were still various gods worshipped at Aketaten. And it's quite true--no one, except Akhenaten, was allowed to worship the Aton without praying first to Akhenaten to "speak" to Aton for him. The closing of the other temples and the eriadication of the name of Amun seems to have been more of a political ploy than a religious war. It was only the priesthood of Amun that was so severely perscuted. In fact, Akhenaten had an image of the Apis bull--or was it the bull itself?--brought to his city.


Osiris I believe the term that best describes your words would be henotheism. A term coined by the 19th Century German Orienatlist, Max Müller. It's meaning can be described as a belief in, and possible worship of, multiple gods, one of which is supreme. It is also called inclusive monotheism or monarchial polytheism. According to Müller, it is "monotheism in principle and a polytheism in fact".

Henothism (as a form of polytheism) is evident throughout the history of Ancient Egypt. In the Old Kingdom, The Great One stays foremost in the background (Atum in the dominant Heliopolitan cosmology). In the Middle Kingdom the first henotheistic attempts occur (Amun as the "King of Gods"). In the new solar theology of the Early New Kingdom, the Great One comes to the fore as Re or as the assimilated Amun-Re. However in the case of Akhenaten, if we shall consider him a henotheist, it is undeniable the most extreme form of henotheism, with respect to Ancient Egypt.

I think we will all agree, regardless of whether we identify Akhenaten's idol worship as henotheism or a monotheism there is no doubt that his religious reform had a major impact on the people, society, and state of Egypt during his time, as well as foreign relations due to his fanaticism. Certainly by 'murdering' Amun, closing the temples, and stripping the Amun priesthood of power, this sent a message to the rest of Egypt. He changed traditions that stood for over 1400 years. Think of how the people of Egypt must have felt. Angry? Resentful? Fearful? I find it hard to believe that is was a joyous time. Yes he had his "devotees" follow him to Akhetaten. Why? Political gain? Fear of not supporting the new chief "God" (Aten)?, Fear of Akhenaten himself and what he might do next if they were not followers? After all he was Pharaoh and had the power to denounce and destroy the chief deity Amun, and many other gods. Also, because he made Nefertiti and himself the sole liaisons between Egypt and the Aten, they held all power over the land of Egypt. People could not worship the new chief deity freely, they had to worship Akhenaten and Nefertiti. It is now that we start to see images of people on their hands and knees bowing their heads to ground in the presence of the Pharaoh and his Queen.
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Osiris II
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2005 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It seems that most of those who followed A. and Nefertiti to Akhetaten and worshipped the Aten did so for political reasons and personal gain.
We're not positive, but many members of the old court changed their names to show higher regard for Aten, were represented in tomb-paintings with deformities like the Pharaoh, were shown geting gifts from the Royal Couple--Aye at the Window of Appearences, for example--in other words, kissed a** and after Akhenaten's death, quickly changed names back to show respect to Amun, followed the moving of the court , and worshipped the old gods. Sounds like today's "yes" men...
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