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zahi hawass
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Ramsekh
Gods/Goddesses


Joined: 03 Aug 2004
Posts: 746

PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2005 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maatkeru, stop flaming!
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Si-amun
Pharaoh


Joined: 02 Jul 2004
Posts: 947
Location: London, England

PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2005 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why do you ask us to stop the discussion you started? I checked your post history and you ahve not made a single post in any other topic other than this one. You have riled us all up, used the same argument again and again and again. In short, I think you are only here to cause trouble. If you were here to actively participate then you would have made a variety of posts in a variety of topics, not just using politics and history to upset everyone on this post. If we stop this discussion now, are we to understand that you wont post any more? Or are you actually intending to use this board in much the same way as the rest of us? If you are then I look forward to hearing from you, if not then kindly leave us to get along with ANCIENT EGYPT, not MODERN POLITICS. thankyou.
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Claude II
Egyptian Architect


Joined: 13 Apr 2005
Posts: 112
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2005 11:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Si-amun wrote:
Why do you ask us to stop the discussion you started? I checked your post history and you ahve not made a single post in any other topic other than this one. You have riled us all up, used the same argument again and again and again. In short, I think you are only here to cause trouble. If you were here to actively participate then you would have made a variety of posts in a variety of topics, not just using politics and history to upset everyone on this post. If we stop this discussion now, are we to understand that you wont post any more? Or are you actually intending to use this board in much the same way as the rest of us? If you are then I look forward to hearing from you, if not then kindly leave us to get along with ANCIENT EGYPT, not MODERN POLITICS. thankyou.


That is why I suggested we stop this argument, I have my hands full with
answering to all replies and I am with you all the way this has gone totally
of the topic witch is abut Zahi Hawass and to be honest we will never be
able to come to some kind of understanding Wink

So see you soon in another topic perhaps we agree in that one Laughing
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maatkara
Pharaoh


Joined: 21 Oct 2004
Posts: 705
Location: Valle d'Aosta- Italy

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Claude II wrote:
maatkara wrote:
Ciao Claude II,
I have to say that I really feel disappointed by your behaviour, instead. It looks like you are not able to stand those opinions that can be different from yours and this is not a sign of respect or intelligence...
We are sharing different ideas about one important fact and if you want to have a civil discussion, then you have to respect others' thoughts without offending....
Italy has much more than the British Museum....noone ever said anything like what you said about us...not even Hawass... Wink
I can understand the feeling you have about the return of important pieces to Egypt, but you should also try to understand the point of view of all the thousends of people who have the chance to see those items in our museums, that might not have the same possibilities if those were staying so far away.... Wink


First of all I want to say that I am understanding your point and you are
so right when you saying that one has to respect other peoples opinion!!
This I hope to be understood with. My opinion are different then yours
and your motive to keep KEY RELICS not all relics are for me so bad...
Because the world is bigger then your Iceland!!!!!!!!! for me its cost
the same to visit London for a weekend as 14 days in Egypt and so for
almost any citizen that dont live in the British Iceland. When you read
that and understand that Germans and British peoples only argument
to not send those KEY RELICS BACK to Egypt is because then
you want be able to see them Question what abut the millions of people
around the world who wants to see them that dont live in your countries???
Why should they have to visit your country to see
Key Egyptian historic relics..... If I want to go to Germany or British Iceland
its because I am interested in your local history not be forced to do that
when I am interested in ancient Egyptian history....!!!

This maybe is rood to you but its offending to the rest of the world
when you are forcing us to visit your country just to see this relics

And this is my point and my opinion...!! But can you give one
really good reason why you should hold this Key relics
I would be the first to support it but the reasons you provided me
with so far is not near as good as bringing history home where
it rightfully belong....

Finally I want to say I am sorry if my language and use of words
are abusive but remember I am writing in a foreign language and
if I can be a little funny at the end try to write in Swedish Wink
You will see my point Laughing


it's a foreign language for me as well...I'm italian!!! Exclamation

I will add something later because now I have to go to work...
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Kiya
Prince/Princess


Joined: 25 Sep 2002
Posts: 442
Location: Derby

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Originally posted by Si amun
Quote:
For God's sake. Hawass is an egotistical, arrogant nationalist. If it wasn't for the British and the French then he wouldn't have that much of a job as we spent literally millions of pounds excavating what the Egyptians were content in destroying. It hardly seems fair to pump millions of pounds into expeditions and excavations with little or no help from the Egyptian Govermnet and then for them to keep EVERYTHING we find. If Egypt had cared for its history then Egypt would be allowed a claim in excavations, but in all fairness if we ahdn't dug it up it would probably stay disintergrating under the sand still. If the bust of Nefertiti had not been found by a foreign power how many more years would it have laid under the ground? I think Egypt has a lot to thank us for, instead of being selfish and nationalistic. Hawass should be grateful that foreign powers invested so much money into setting up excavations, not condemning us because we kept a small percentage of the actual treasure we found. I just think it is better off in our museums than lying in the earth (where it would have been had we not taken it).


Here here!

But I don't think Claude II is going to come down off the moral highground on this one! Let's just be happy that the majority of us here don't think the dame!
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Psusennes I
Pharaoh


Joined: 09 Sep 2004
Posts: 913
Location: England

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moral high ground? I think not! If the Rosetta stone and the other prized objects that the British Museum holds were returned to Egypt they would be stored 'carefully' in archaic glass cabinets in dusty side-rooms, along with so many other KEY RELICS of their past.

I agree that the Rosetta stone is better in Britain than lying in the Atlantic Ocean- where it would be if we hadn't carefully rescued, restored and preserved it.
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Claude II
Egyptian Architect


Joined: 13 Apr 2005
Posts: 112
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
But I don't think Claude II is going to come down off the moral highground on this one! Let's just be happy that the majority of us here don't think the same!


Well if the majority is 4 people of over 600 users then you are right Wink

I dont think I am alone with my opinion and nether are you
we are probably divide by Country.
Germany, France and England v.s The rest of the world and I can inform
you that at this point there is 2482 signatures on the protestlist
and it still growing. There are not many English signatures
but a lot of German and France.. so my horse is not as high as yours Wink

So rest a sure even if its going to take some time your bound to release
the Rosetta stone sooner or later its just a question of time.. Laughing

And as I have written before THE WORLD ARE PROUD AND GRATEFUL
THAT YOU DID TAKE CARE OF THIS IMPORTANT RELIC.....
But the times has changed and those relics should be sent back home
and why not give the Museums around the world the job to establish
a new Museum in Egypt where they all could be responsible for keeping
this relics....
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Si-amun
Pharaoh


Joined: 02 Jul 2004
Posts: 947
Location: London, England

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, kindly shut up. I have had more than enough of your smug self important rantings. I really dont think I can log on to this site and reply in a civil manner if you carry on posting. I actual regret answering to this topic in the first place, something that has never happened to me ont his forum before. I hope you are happy by that. And just so that you know for future reference, repeating your initial argument wont allow anything to progress, one of the main reasons this argument stagnated so quickly. Also, getting personal is hardly an adult thing to do whilst debating an issue, and please dont use this board as a soap box to promote your political views, I dont like it and I am sure not many people on here like it. We are here to discuss events that have been over for thousands of years, if you want to discuss modern politics can I advise that you please join a political forum?
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Claude II
Egyptian Architect


Joined: 13 Apr 2005
Posts: 112
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Mon Apr 18, 2005 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First of all this is not all modern politic. We are talking abut Dr. Hawass
quest to bring home Key ancient relics so we are discussing ancient
history.

To my insulting of people here? I have not used one word for anyone
personally here to insult you. I have not told anyone to shut up or to
eat them self or in any other way insulted you.
I have discussed and tried your arguments if that is insulting
I am sorry but how could we discuss if we where not to test are
arguments. If you take the time and read all replies you should
not that I am only using word that you and your friends them self have
written. I have not called any one in person idiot or anything like that
but you can read what you all have called me in your own words

But I can take that because if you sticks your head out you have
to take a blow or two Wink
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Kiya
Prince/Princess


Joined: 25 Sep 2002
Posts: 442
Location: Derby

PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2005 11:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Things have got pretty heated, espeacially me but i hate greed and selfishness!
We've debated the various pro's/cons so the topic can't really go that much further. Lets just agree to disagree on this one and leave it at that. end of story. Our opinions will not change a single thing.
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Hatshepsut76
Prince/Princess


Joined: 10 Apr 2005
Posts: 211
Location: Roma, Italy

PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2005 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think that it's worth considering Kiya's opinion good.
It was my idea that the debate was not following the right way anymore...
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Claude II
Egyptian Architect


Joined: 13 Apr 2005
Posts: 112
Location: Sweden

PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2005 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with you both the discussion has lost its track that is abut
Dr. Hawass and yes we could never come to a compromise or
an understanding so that is why I proposed we stop this discussion

Of cause I take my responsibility... In the heat of the discussion
its easy to slip a way and talk abut everything. But in this case
I think some of the reasons given are true imperialistic nonsense
and the fact that people think that its only English, Germans and France
should have exclusive access to this relics by keeping
them in those countries only is a little bit odd.
They could be better shared with the rest of the world in Cairo Museum
then of cause we can agree that the Cairo Museum should improve it self
and be better to show and take care of their relics and treasures

Oooops I did it again
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maatkara
Pharaoh


Joined: 21 Oct 2004
Posts: 705
Location: Valle d'Aosta- Italy

PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2005 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yes, dear!
we all agree on one point: that you are not able to have a civil discussion because you always want to be right. This has lead our attention to what you were saying to all of us and not to the main subject. The result is that even if some of us might share your opinion, he is now thinking different due to your uncorrect behaviour.
Next time you'd better think about that!
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Psusennes I
Pharaoh


Joined: 09 Sep 2004
Posts: 913
Location: England

PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2005 3:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps if Cairo were to proudly display and preserve the wondrous relics that it already has then we might be able to even consider returning the Rosetta stone and other relics to Egypt. We put our objects from the BM on tours across the world to share them with other countries. The last time Egypt did that to us was in the seventies. I hardly think it would be sensible to thrust yet more priceless objects into the claws of that greedy egotist Zahi Hawass, when he cannot even cope with what he already has!
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Si-amun
Pharaoh


Joined: 02 Jul 2004
Posts: 947
Location: London, England

PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2005 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well said, that is actually an amazingly good point. I am quite sick of this discussion now though. Claude, could you please drop it once and for all? I am sorry to say but it really infuriates me that you use the same arguments again and again and again, you obviously dont have much of an experience with debating. God, I would hate to be stuck in a debate with you in person. At least over the internet I cant tut, roll my eyes or get to angry. All this crap you are spouting about Imperialism is, quite frankly, really insulting. How dare you call me an Imperialist (and look into the meaning before using it), you dont know me at all. How can I be an Imperialist when my two closest friends come from countries that used to be in the British Empire? If I were an Imperialist I would hardly be best friends with an Indian Sikh and a Carribean Black Girl! So dont you dare call me nationalistic, racist or colonialist (all terms covered in the word Imperialist). I do not support the monarchy, I dont like the idea of an Empire, I am not racist, I am not patriotic and I dont see myself as superior to other countries. How dare you call me that when I am in fact the enemy of what Imperialism actually is. Idiot.
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